66. Dylan Dunlap: Let go of your ego
season 3, episode 6
Episode: 66
Today we talk to the intimidating talented Dylan Dunlap who couldn’t be any less intimidating to talk to. He shares his journey through Berklee and getting a record deal all the while finding what it means to take care of your mental health. We also discuss the way ego may be sabotaging the progress on your next project.
Quote of the week
“Success is such a mindset…not something we need to chase” - Dylan Dunlap
On days he’s not touring, Dylan can be found in LA, Nashville, and NYC, amassing writing and production credits for pop, country, reggae, and hip-hop artists. Music has been a meaningful outlet for Dylan, as he has gone through many struggles of his own and knows the importance of a helping hand when dealing with mental illness. This is why he has rededicated his efforts as a musician to breaking the stigma and raising awareness. In this mission, Dylan received the ‘Fighting Stigma Rising Star’ award from the National Alliance on Mental Illness and has partnered with Global Citizen, Autism Rocks, and various local organizations to continue addressing the importance of mental health. (Last.fm)
Non-profit of the week
This week's Music nonprofit is from Fort Collins, Colorado MusicMindsMatter.org Caring for the minds that make the music you love. They offer a safe space for musicians and those involved in the music scene to chat about successes or challenges they offer a safe place for musicians and those involved in music seem to chat about successes or challenges were facing while participating in the music scene. They also do mental wellness meetings every Monday so I highly suggest you check them out if you're in the area. Definitely a safe place to go. If you need some support wanna hang out with some like minded musicians. Learn more at MusicMindsMatter.org
Chris Webb 2:37
Los Angeles based singer, songwriter, multi instrumentalist, producer and mental health advocate, Dylan Dunlap. Thank you for joining us here on musician's tip jar.
Unknown Speaker 2:48
I'm so happy to be here. Thanks for having me.
Chris Webb 2:51
This podcast is primarily focused on finance for musicians, but it's also it's like a motivational speech version of that, you know, it's our intent is to show people that, that there's millions of others that that have the same aspirations that are finding ways to succeed financially to continue being able to be the artists that they feel they are inside, you know. So, whenever we're sitting here being like, let's get rich, you know, like, that's not what the podcast is for. It is, it is an idea that, that so often we, we give up on what we are being called to do, because of the weight that the money can create, you know,
Dylan Dunlap 3:29
this is something that I talk about weekly. So I am honored to, I'm honored to be here and whatever my pea brain can offer to this conversation. But it's I think mindset is so important. And I'm excited to talk through all of this men that thank you both for what you're doing, because it feels I'm imagining this is a terrifying time to start and want to pick up an instrument like the one hang in there. And I'm sure you guys offer a lot of warmth in this time, or maybe help people feel a little bit less alone. You know, so just thanks for I can be thanking you guys a lot because usually, with interviews, it's when did you start playing music? When's your next release? But like, these are the conversations that I I crave for so man, I'm so so happy to be here.
Chris Webb 4:25
We talk a lot about how many ways there are to make a career in this business. And there's really no there's really an unlimited amount of ways to make it happen. And I think that the more that the industry progresses in the new environment of technology and such This becomes even more true. Can we start with talking a little bit about what your journey into the music industry has been like so far?
Unknown Speaker 4:47
Of course, I think I just threw myself in the deep end when I realized that couldn't afford college anymore. And I took a year in Boston moved back to LA and illegally started street performing in downtown Burbank, which not many people were fans of at the time. And I think I understood the value of $1. Then when I was 19, I was standing there. And, you know, I'm sure you guys are familiar with the hustle that goes into this and just as much as I am, and you have to be okay with walking away at the end of the day of a six, eight hour shift, having made three or $4. And not identify yourself as I'm only as valuable as, yep. But be okay with it. And I think I just started from absolute scratch counting every single penny I made. And just realize that, like, if I continue to do this, and maybe I can continue to gather like minded people that believe in the same values that I do, we can maybe turn this into a business. I mean, years ago, I experienced that on the street, and I'm still learning how I can improve as a, as a businessman as the owner of my LLC. Like, I think it's just a constant state of growth that I have to be willing to be in. At all times,
Dave Tamkin 6:09
when you went to Berkeley?
Dylan Dunlap 6:23
I'll tell you what I was, I was eating ramen. And yeah, I'm teaching myself how to play the guitar in a subway. And it's just, it's just
I forget exactly. It's very prestigious. I do forget the except the acceptance rates, and how to speak English in the morning, I forget. But I think it was just so traumatizing, like, putting all my eggs mentally in that basket and succeeding, and getting these accolades at the school in real time and teaching myself how to do other things. Because I was just a film composer at the time, not being able to afford continuing, and it not being something that you did, you're not responsible for that outcome. That was the hardest thing. So I think maybe I'm just, I don't talk about Berkeley, I don't talk about like the voice I don't talk about like the early baby Dillon stages of dipping my toes in music, because I really only identify myself as what I'm doing right now, which is just like living and breathing the thing and not really caring about how I can explain what I do in the Sexiest way. Like, I'm so excited to for this conversation, because this is, this is what I call my hobbit hole that I'm video chatting you guys from and I just live and breathe music 24/7
Dave Tamkin 7:58
I think too many people look backwards to define themselves, when they could be defining themselves by what they have ahead of them. And that's a pretty good way to put it that you know, you're not discussing, or looking back to what you said baby Dylan has done. But we're here to discuss where you are now and what your future looks like, too. So that's where I think if more musicians put their focus on success would come want to say easier, but definitely have your eye on the prize.
Dylan Dunlap 8:29
I have so many thoughts about this. What I wish I knew earlier is that success was always a mindset. You know, it was just always a way that we choose to see ourselves as successful as fulfilled as that's not something we need to chase. You know, because I feel like just chasing means implies that we don't have something now. And yeah, so I'm very grateful that you guys seem to be like minded in this because I think what you're alluding to Dave is that a lot of people are struggling to access this mindset, in a healthy way where they can afford to do what they want to do, mentally. And literally,
Chris Webb 9:07
we often find ourselves looking at what we can afford, and making that the reason that we can't succeed, right? I mean, there's so often you leaving school might have been when you decided to go get a real job, you know, but you didn't do that.
Dave Tamkin 9:23
But like you said, you weren't concentrating on not defining yourself by the money that you were making. At that time when I say you are busking but even now it's about the journey and with you know, I guess we'll get into this soon, you know, about, you know, your mental, the mental health of it all. And defining that as success as well. To have you know, a holistic picture of what success is
Dylan Dunlap 9:46
mental health is number one on that field, and everything else can will come and go but if we are not taking care of ourselves, I don't really care about anything thing that comes our way, because I don't think we'll be able to process it, I don't think we'll be able to be kind to ourselves. When the good comes, I feel like when a lot of success comes now, in my career, it's a lot of me sifting through the emotions of how can I feel worthy of what's what's happening? You know, how can I feel? deserving? Because I've been so hard on myself for so long, welcoming in new successes is a newfound thing I'm working through as well. Was there a
Chris Webb 10:26
Was there a moment with once you kind of got, you know, to the reality that you're gonna have to do this on your own? Essentially, right? If I might sum up what might have hit you once you left school and, and had to do that? Was there a moment where you're like, I'm gonna have to, you know, push through the feeling of rejection, the feeling of being financially unstable, like, and that you saw some sort of light at the end of that? Well, what what, you know, what is it that keeps you going in those moments that got you through that,
Dylan Dunlap 10:55
I have no control over it. Music is not a choice, man. I it's not a job. It's, it's a way out. For me, I've realized that recently, in terms of the significant amount of childhood trauma that I suppressed, and then unpacked, as an adult, and worked through in therapy. I don't know, man, I think when I got out of my own way, recently, and realize that this is it's not unhealthy that I lean on music, at in a time of struggle, it's actually healthy to project whatever it is you're feeling anger, sadness, whatever it is into the music and turning it into a piece of art. That's the way out and and that was my way out since I was six years old, and decided to teach myself piano so I can just drown out the noise of my parents fighting. And it's always been the way it's just been a matter of if I'm willing to accept that this is my calling. And this is the thing I'm so clearly meant to continue doing. I think it's just having to let go of that ego and let go of that control. And yeah, when when you truly love something the way in which I'm failing at articulating correctly right now, if you truly love it, I don't think about anything other than just how good it makes me feel to play the piano sitting right here. Yeah. There's nothing else crossing my mind, even business. Truly. Yeah, it's just the therapeutic qualities that it provides, and how to just stay focused on that. And somehow on the other end, I ended up with material that can turn into what I call penny stocks, which is my music, you know, like, you put out enough singles, they're treated like the stock market, you know, but like, it all starts with just like a feeling. And I'm really happy to just be this aware, to tap into that and make sure I'm I'm only honoring that. six year old me now, still. Yeah.
Chris Webb 12:56
Right. And that is amazing. Because what you're saying is what we feel like so many artists are like, Well, I had no other choice, you know, in a good way. Like, this was the way out of all of my pain. With my trauma, this was the way out of me being broke, this was my way out of feeling trapped. This was that's what music often really, there's that many other careers that people were like, Well, I had to become a brain surgeon, because it was my way out of my trauma, you know, like, no, that doesn't really happen. But this type of art, this this art form, that is therapy in itself so often, but also a way to add value right to the world. And that's the only reason you're getting paid is because you are adding value to our lives with the music and the honesty that you're able to keep intact. And I think when you write a song, you know you're doing it because that's releasing something right. And the rest of us are glad to pay you for that. Because you're giving us the same feeling that we're trying to articulate ourselves. In addition
Dave Tamkin 14:03
to that, saying that you look at your songs like Penny stocks, with the foundation being that you sit down to play your piano for no other reason than to play piano and the joy that it brings you and to express yourself, I think is something that can be two different things. Two things can be true. And musicians sometimes forget that, that there's nothing wrong with expressing your soul and having that and then also monetizing it to make sure that you could continue expressing your soul. And when there's musicians that say, Oh, I don't you know, I don't want to post or I don't want to do this or I don't want to push myself in front of these people. Well, you have, you know, it's a circle. If you want to spend the time creating, then you also have to create that flow for yourself or hire people that know how to do it better than you can see. I'll stop talking to no,
A.I. midjourney
Dylan Dunlap 14:54
no, that is very, very intelligent. And I think that
Dave Tamkin 14:58
Can we replay that too? Over and over, just sample it, again, several times. I'll get that, mark that
Dylan Dunlap 15:05
I can also articulate it very slowly if you'd like. You do it up here.
Yeah. I think that once I realized that, like, social media can be your friend, and you don't have to play the game, I recognize I used to think that was a privilege, you know, maybe you guys can agree, or relate, maybe you've felt this way in the past, we look up to a very successful artist, that is probably where you want to end up being someday. And you'd think like, oh, they have this privilege, they can step away from social media, because they are now where they are, where I am defining them to be. But the truth is, the sheer amount of confidence that it takes to walk away, when the world is all telling us, like, spend every waking moment on this platform, and then seven other platforms, because that's how you're going to be able to make a living, the truth is, I realized, I can figure out how it works for me, just like you guys, can I and you do. Like you can chisel that very generalized recommendation from the music industry. And you can just figure out, like, what makes me feel comfortable. And to let the both of you know, I hate being in front of a camera. And I, I hate a lot of variables attached to music. And that's why I love music so much as I'm willing to do all these other things. But I have to be honest with myself, and figure out what works for me. And what I've realized. It's live content, it's me being a nerd in my, again, my hobbit hole and in in Pro Tools, and I'm not trying to get your attention anymore. I think I just like, again, got out of my own way. And just focused on the music, and trusting that I will be able to package it and represent it in a way that is authentic, which matters more than marketability. But then maybe there the same thing is kind of what you were alluding to Dave, it's kind of like all feeds that same same beast,
Dave Tamkin 17:11
Authenticity will win over marketing at any day, you know, that is the marketing authenticity is what you show up to as your life as a person for your music. So thank you, you have your head on straight when it comes to that, because no one can take that away from you.
Dylan Dunlap 17:28
Or the truth is, none of us know we're doing and I certainly don't. And things are not going to work and and some things are. And that's why I think I might have subconsciously brought up penny stocks. Because if you have that little expectation, it's not that you're not believing your music. It's just I want to put out a lot of music. I want to do this for the rest of my freakin life. Yeah, why why stare at the next song on the horizon and go all my eggs in this basket, this one better be the head. Why not just make a folder, a folder of songs that I love my children. And then I can remove the expectation that will breed into disappointment. And enjoy this the next 12 months or whatever it is like I think that we're all forgetting that we're supposed to enjoy this. Like, I think we've glorified and romanticized the hustle and the like the being in the trenches mentality. And I'm tired. I don't know about you guys, but I'm like, I'm exhausted trying to think about this, like everyone's out to get me. And I got to, I got to spend every waking moment trying to beg for everybody's attention. And I just want to focus on what fulfills me now, at this point in my life, I'm sure you guys can relate to that.
Chris Webb 18:39
Absolutely. What you're saying is you're finding ways to sustain, right? I mean, it's can be so exhausting. If you're going upstream all the time doing things that don't feel right, right. Or they feel exhausting, just because you're trying to get attention all the time. Like, no one wants to dress up like a clown every day and go stand on the street corner, you know, like it just doesn't feel right. And what I love what you just said there was that quantity, you have to be willing to put the quantity out there. Right. And, and I you know, working at the university, I see so much hesitation to put anything out because it's not perfect yet. It's not just the way they thought it would be in their head. And then I keep trying to say gently is that? Well, you can't do that yet. You know, like what's in your head, it needs to be there and it needs to be really defined. But the truth is, perhaps like you need to release these next ones first to get to that point where you're releasing the stuff that's in the head already, you know, but you have to put it out there.
Dylan Dunlap 19:33
This is a very sensitive topic because what we're seeing is incorrect. We're seeing quantity outweigh quality and the quality diminish in a majority of the music that we look up to right and and I think it's It's teaching us and I'm not going to say names but the CEO of a certain DSP has recommended sorry, there's no time you have to continue this cycle and maybe move away from albums. And, and focus on the single driven mindset that it's going to put us all in nursing homes. And I just think that I, okay, I'm trying to collect my thoughts. And also, I had COVID, like five weeks ago, and I'm still just, my throat is still killing me. So you guys are gonna get a very raspy man for this podcast today.
Chris Webb 20:20
You sound fine.
Dave Tamkin 20:21
Yeah, glad you're doing okay, glad you're doing better.
Dylan Dunlap 20:24
Thanks so much. I appreciate that. This is okay. I think this is a sensitive topic, because we're not having the right conversation. The thing that you just mentioned about people at the university is the same thing. I'm saying I'm, I'll be 27 in a week or two. And I think that I see this behavior now. And it tells me it's not an age thing, then it's, it's a fear of what will not happen. It's it's what happens when the song is or the the project is sitting on the hard drive. And it's it enough time passes with not doing anything with the product, within you just fester in your mind and then and then think, well, what if it gets like five streams, and I'm gonna say something to my younger self right now, that sounds very cutthroat and ruthless. But the truth is, get the five streams. And I promise you, the one after that is going to get 10 streams. And I promise you, younger Dylan, that the snowball effect is your greatest superpower and advantage. And you do not have to sacrifice quality of your art in the process, there's a way or at least I believe now there's a way where I can keep my head down and stay in a 21 day cycle of writing a song. And I'll probably always have something on the horizon, hopefully keeping them in a healthy mentality in the process.
Chris Webb 21:47
And you have such an attention to detail in your melodies and your lyrics and in the nuance within your voice. Like all of those things only come from listening back to yourself from other people's ears, you know what I mean? Like, at least this is in my mind, what people experience from putting the music out there is how it, how it actually survives on its own how it lives. And that's so much information that we can then take back for the next
Dylan Dunlap 22:11
right. But that is so important for us to learn from ourselves, our past work, and that's such an interesting way that you just described that like hearing us through other years, I do a very bizarre thing where I part of me kills the song after it comes out, but not in a violent way, in a way that holds me accountable to never identify as just this one moment, if it's a great moment, I'm always focused on what I imagined, like, you know, like back in the day, they would say, the only thing that people would ask you is what do you have next? Like they don't really necessarily I mean, whatever you present at the table could be really attractive. But I think there's a level of attractive attractiveness to vision. And I'm just I'm grateful to always know that only as good as an excellent, you know, hopefully, I can just keep hitting it and keep being a student in life. And, and but again, I have to kill the past in a way and embrace it, and tour it every night, of course, and be happy and fulfilled doing these songs that live forever, but kill the ego, that is still expecting something to happen. That's That's what I think we're all really struggling with is just getting out of our own way of this, this ego that's telling us I deserve a million streams, i This song is worth a million streams. So therefore, it needs to equate to those six zeros. Like there's a serious
Chris Webb 23:39
I don't put it out right or else it's just not ready yet. I'm just that's why it's not ready. And then there's that
Dylan Dunlap 23:45
like the demo itis of just convincing yourself that it's not done, which I have done for years.
Chris Webb 23:49
It's the easiest thing to do. Right? It's much easier than putting it out. In and you talked about quantity. And you also mentioned the willingness to fail. I think if we can spend just a few minutes talking about like what your songwriting process is you said you spend like you know, 21 days straight on a song. That's, that's amazing. But what parts of this question if you're willing, one is sort of when you're writing the song, like, do you do a lot of CO writing? Or is it very isolated kind of experience? Most of the time? And then do you produce it? At the same time? I've seen a lot of people doing that now. Because they kind of envision what that end result is going to be as it's been written like, I'm just curious what your take on that as an approach.
Dylan Dunlap 24:34
I'm a huge fan of collaborating with people that can do everything and myself knowing I can jump around and all of us leaving the ego at the door and going we don't have to do everything and so I'm I'm a huge fan that I have a team of people that we feel like a super group. It feels like we're just like the Avengers together but but but also like, you split us up and Like Kirk, my best friend, he is my guitarist, any graphic design you have seen online has been him for the last eight years of our friendship. He does so many other things than just providing what he does for the Dylan project. And I just liked that there's always like this intention of having less is more, even though he's one of the best graphic designers in the world. That doesn't mean we need to make the most loudest, The Most Extreme design for the artwork. It goes, it's the same with music just because Kirk is arguably one of the most talented guitar players I've ever met, doesn't mean he needs to do a traditional guitar solo in a song. Yeah, I think we're just so intentional. And to answer your question, I've spent my entire career working towards getting to where I'm at now. And I think I would love to share with you what it's like right now. Because it's very fluid, and it's very free flowing. And there's one rule and it's just don't obsess. And don't think at all,
Dave Tamkin 26:00
that that's two rules.
Dylan Dunlap 26:05
It'll become a rulebook by the end of this. I just think that the second I start, like, second guessing myself, I'm wrong. Yeah. And when I move away from the gut instinct of what that motif should have been, or what that lyric should have been, even though the lyric was visceral, and wrong, or graphic or something, but it's, it's right. You know, like, sometimes I, I write the song and like, in my head, before writing it, and I plan out all the dynamics and everything. And the second I go to like, lay it down, I go down hours of downward spirals of just making the wrong calls, because I wasn't honoring what was in my head. And so now that I have this space where I can wake up, like I did this morning, right before this call, I track a bunch of guitars for the next project. And I only gave myself 20 to 30 minutes to track these guitars. And so I know me, I know that my OCD is a branch of a bigger mental health condition. But if I limit myself, because professionally, I have this task to show up on zoom in again, do the thing I hate people get getting to see my face, I limit myself to sitting in my closet, only 20 minutes. And I guarantee you guys, when I get off this call, I'm not going to feel like I need to redo these guitars. And normally, I would have spent 810 hours just perfecting everything to a tee, right. So I'm learning that I don't need to do much at all, other than just be awake and listening, listening to my body, listening to what's around me. And what I have told you has ended up it's really bizarre, but it's a 21 day period of inception, sitting in the chorus for a week, producing backwards, so I start the loudest. And then by the 21st day I have a fully bounced what I call Hobbit. It was okay in North Hollywood, I call them apartment demos now their their Hobbit Hobbit mixes, I don't know what he gets, maybe you can help me trademark this. It's I've got it down to a science where I don't have to hate myself anymore. And I can just after the 21st day, like be proud of myself and and move on. And I appreciate you saying that 21 days is attractive earlier. But the truth is, I think we all grew up in a narrative that said like 45 minutes is attractive, you know, like, we wrote that song. And in five minutes, it just came out of me, I want to be somebody that represents the art that can best represent the chaos, that is my life, and my brain is going to be the art that took the most time. And and I'm happy to promote that I even though in my brain, everything kind of makes sense. I'm not the kind of person that's ever going to monetize or market the fact that like something was written in a short period of time, because length, to me is how willing you are to stay until the very end until that's right, right. And I'm proud to be in this having been in this cycle for 12 months now of the 21 day thing. So it's been been a great year to reflect on it all.
Chris Webb 29:13
I was just listening to an interview with Chris Martin. And he he actually said something very similar to what you just said in regards to. I mean, he was kind of saying that a lot of his songs, he feels like they come from somewhere and are given to him, you know, which I had never heard him say before. But that I do think we all feel that we have moments where like, Wow, where did that come from? Then he leaned into it and then you kind of focusing on it. But his whole point was about why he spent so much time in the studio is because he feels like he now has to honor that that creation that was given to him from somewhere that that you need to be willing to spend the time to get it right in the studio. And, you know, we it's a practice, right we I sometimes lose patience with myself and I just want to be like this is done. I'm not gonna get to get this right and then that can be such a weakness too.
Dylan Dunlap 30:02
So have you brought up Chris Martin? Oh, yeah, he, I'm happy to tell you this, which I realized recently was a father figure in a way, like from afar for me like, or I projected that onto him through my father's absence, and through my just deep dive into a rush of blood to the head, and then becoming as obsessed as I am like, I think he helped me a lot without even realizing it. And I've never heard him talk about that, or maybe I have in one of those documentaries, but I do agree. I don't think the songs are ours. And I think that whether or not you believe anyone believes that to be true, I do it with my blood, sweat, and tears, I do not take credit for my music. But what I think is important about this mentality, even if you don't believe in it fully is is that you stop focusing on like, the split sheets, and you're worth on the on the back end it like, you stopped focusing on looking at the people in your life, as as $1 sign and you stop focusing on like how you can make the most because look, the three of us, if it's one thing we can get behind, it's the fact that like, this is one of the most impossible times to do music. And it's, it's so difficult to afford to be able to do that. I just think that I've written some of my favorite music when I stopped trying to write, and I stopped trying to say, like, I wrote it, I don't know what it is, but it is not me, I, I am grateful to be a vessel. When I the second I got out of my own ways, when the real songs and everything I'm talking about, it's funny, none of it even exists yet, like I am having to realize that whatever music you might have listened to before this podcast of mine, or earlier. That's that's where you've lived in. And and what I'm talking about is a five phase cinematic universe of a folder for the next two years of music that I've like lined up. So I I have to learn how to have more grace for myself with the past, because that's apparently all that you guys have gone off of, as you speak to me today. And I'm grateful for that. Because it's a younger, what I would consider as a songwriter like just haven't lived as much yet. There's a lot that can happen in a year or two. And I just I, I know, I said this at the top of the podcasts, but I appreciate your ears, in listening to the music, and knowing that you're actually absorbing the intent behind it.
Chris Webb 32:33
And as consumers, we must always do that, right. I mean, we're only we're only able to absorb what you've given us. I wonder how much Chris Barton has written that he's never released, you know, I wonder about that, because I feel I feel disappointed that there might be music that I would really love. And you know, that he's never given me. And it's almost like you're a little mad about that, you know. And in the same way in and I don't mean this in like an aggressive way. But in the same way, I'm like really anxious to get what you've got, you know, like, because it is powerful, and it means something,
Dylan Dunlap 33:04
it saved my life. And I That's it, you know, there will never be another insecurity about the performance of these songs on DSPs in the future, this the second, something happens in your life, or multiple things happen that kind of like, remind you of your mortality, and remind you of the fact that all of this energy we have is borrowed. I'm so much happier now. And I'm comfortable talking to creating closure through my art. That never happened in my life. That's like a huge theme, I guess, about that there might be like 12 this year, but like about everything in the future is is you have so much power with your fingers to be able to pick up that guitar right there. And create a reality that helps you through the rest of your life. And for me with so many moments that that really affected my ability to or my brain to develop the way it needed to. What an offensive thing for me to do to be worried about, like how the songs do in the future, because they were I would argue there have been moments where I've only had the music and and it's a lonely feeling. But then you kind of come out of it and you realize how grateful you are. And I'm sure both of you had those. You can recall those moments where like, maybe it didn't feel like anybody else was there for whatever reason, but music has never left you and it's never left me since that six year old story I told you so I just want to carry that mentality into the new year because there are a lot of changes in business and stuff and a lot of ownership that I have in a lot of leadership roles that I know, have to take on. And I welcome that. But again, it's mentality. I just have to make sure I continue to take care of myself and focus on How healing the, the healing properties of this music.
Chris Webb 35:04
And along those lines, you are even very vocal about being a mental health advocate. And, and we talk a lot about the the, maybe not as directly, but we talk a lot about the idea of how important it is to have strength within like to be taking care of yourself mentally, in order to sustain this career and in order to sustain anything where you're really giving yourself to the rest of the world. So in the context, specifically, of musicians pursuing their dreams, what are some of the things that that you do to help nurture your mental health?
Dylan Dunlap 35:43
I'm crazy. So I'm just going to say this before I say it. But I have this note in my phone that I started in February 2021. Without planning this, I didn't even feel like I was coming up with the idea. And I just wrote an all caps 12 month stream of consciousness, and I would put in bold, what day it was. And then let myself word vomit. I guess like at the time, it was really just like to have a nice way to categorize lyrics, feelings that maybe turn into lyrics, but a lot of it, I think, was just, I felt so alone in so many different ways. And I just gave myself the opportunity to not filter my thoughts. And I, you could call that journaling, you could call that getting a diary, you know, but like, for me, virtually, we're all on our phones so much. So it's on my phone. And I to this day, I have written paragraphs and paragraphs, and sometimes words that are not sentences and like just gibberish, every single day, for almost 12 months now. Wow. I'm so I didn't realize this, but like, every song has come out of that, coincidentally, but it wasn't like the main focus, the main focus is to prioritize the mental health, and to trust that the music is going to be there to the it's gonna rise to the top, like, if you take care of yourself. Or if you don't, you're gonna make great music about not taking care of yourself, but then something's gonna happen down the line where you realize something doesn't feel right. I'm trying to juggle this, because I've seen and you guys probably more than I have, like, time and time again, people not taking care of themselves, and experiencing success at the same time. And the way I view myself right now is I think I've been, it's felt like an incubator phase for a very long time. And I look at my career now and the top of this year, and I'm just like, I think a lot is gonna happen. None of it matters unless I continue to work on myself the way I started at the top of last year. So I, I did that I allowed that stream of consciousness to flow. I then went to a very specific therapist that specializes in what's called Eye Movement, desensitization and reprocessing EMDR. He is also autistic, which was very comforting to because I don't know many people, other than myself, and I, in this therapy, you have to recollect really traumatic events and talk about it in real time and stare at a light that oscillates, left to right. And it's very challenging, and it exhausts you for the rest of your day afterwards. And, but I did that for I did 15 sessions of that last year. And I worked through things that I didn't know that I was struggling with, I worked through things that the ways in which I viewed my father, my mother, that my childhood, and I'm slowly realizing that what I've always known to be true that it's okay to ask for help. But I'm slowly realizing that it's okay to talk about asking for help in the real ways, because advocating for mental health, especially in music, it's kind of stigmatized, and can look not authentic. And I've realized, like, best way I can take care of myself is if if I have my phone, and I have to post something or whatever. Or I have to do something that is related to my career, just just represent who I am today, in whatever version of of that is, tell yourself, that's good enough. Like, I'm just doing a lot of the work to catch up for the years of it feels like I was in a coma emotionally for so I spent a lot of my time just wanting to go deep with the peers in my life and the friends in my life and talk about these things, especially as a man with masculinity issues that we all struggle with. But I just I want to put in the work and I want to show up to therapy and I want to finally be proud of the efforts I'm making outside of music. Because again, coincidentally, I'm sure I'm sure it helps. In the end.
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As always, Thanks for joining us and remember there is already enough for everyone, you just need to know how to get it. Until next time, on behalf of Dave Tamkin and myself, Chris Webb. Stay happy, healthy and wealthy. Your mental health is more important than that album, song, sold out show and any amount of money. So give it some love.
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